036- Advocating For Our Kids Needs Everywhere with Sarah Young

Anouk:
Welcome to the podcast. Today on the podcast, we'll talk more in-depth about advocating for children. It's something that I touched on a while ago. I'll link that episode in the show notes. But we will go much more in that today with our guest, Sarah Sarah Young. She's a neurospicy warrior, homeschooling by mom, devoted wife, and passionate business owner. Her life's journey through doctor's offices, hospitals, and self advocacy led her to empower moms. Through a podcast and a special needs mom membership, she amplified voices and creates an event of support, sharing knowledge and strength.

Anouk:
She helps special needs mom conquer challenging challenges one heartbeat at a time. And Sarah has been advocating for herself and her kids since she's a kid herself. So she has a lot of experience on the subject. Let's welcome Sarah over on the podcast. Welcome to Parenting the Intensity, where we'll talk all about how we can drop the general parenting advice that doesn't work with our emotionally intense kids anyway, and let go of the unrealistic expectations society puts on us as parents. Together, we'll find solutions and ideas that work for you and your kids. Chances are, deep down, you know what they need. But you need a little encouragement to keep going on other days and permission to do things differently and help you fully trust that you already are a wonderful parent to your exceptional but challenging kid.

Anouk:
Do you read all the things, listen to all the things, take all the courses, and you know all of things about parenting, but you struggle to actually apply them in your real life, then you're in luck. I just started the Parenting the Intensity community, which is a monthly group support for parents of emotionally intense kids. And the goal is exactly that, to take all the information you learn from the podcast and from all the other sources and adapt them so that it works for your child and your family, your reality. Because things can work, but not always the same way for everybody. So the same thing might need to be adapted to work for you. And sometimes it's hard to sort through everything to choose the right things that so that you can really enjoy your life and your kids, not always being afraid of the next outburst. You can join by clicking on the link, in the show notes or on the website.

Anouk:
Welcome, Sara. I'm really glad to have you over

Sarah Young:
today. Thanks for having me, Anouk. I'm super excited.

Anouk:
So today, we'll address advocacy. And can you start before we jump in the subject to by introducing yourself and tell us why you do what you do?

Sarah Young:
Well, it was a little bit of a twisty turny journey. I I started with you know, I am my my child has struggled for years in school. And due to that, plus a number of other things, we ended up pulling them out several years ago to homeschool. And around the same time, you know, I went from being out and about to home every day. So I started a podcast for moms just kind of to connect. And long story short, through that, I'm I'm kind of like a a chihuahua, so to speak. It's kind of because when I want something, I was, you know, just kind of raised to go get it. And I've I've had health problems.

Sarah Young:
I've had Crohn's since I was 5. And, and through that, I mean, we went through years getting a diagnosis, doctors telling my mom everything under the sun, but what was wrong.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And just kind of, you know, Crohn's was a newer thing when I was growing up and so my mom had to fight every step of the way to get me service. Medications, doctors, whatever, and so that's all I knew. You know, I I grew up knowing, well, if you need something, you push till you get it till somebody listens. And so I kind of guess assumed everybody was that way. And so when I started the podcast and started interacting with other moms and I was like, oh, you mean if somebody tells if a doctor tells you no, y'all just go okay? Like, why? And so through through that process, then I was like, oh, this is something that a lot of people struggle with that. A lot of people coming to me like other moms I knew with well, I really my kid's struggling with this, so they're struggling with that, and the school's not listening to me or the doctor's not listening to me or whatever. What do I do to get heard? And from there, it just kinda morphed into me becoming Anouk a parent advocacy coach and understanding that this is just really something that a lot of people struggle with

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And and just need that that extra support whether it is somebody giving them a script to say, hey. These are some things you can say or a checklist because we all know you get in front of a group of school people or a doctor's office or whatever it is. And sometimes you're like, ah, you get so overwhelmed and there's several of them sitting across from you and you're like you you just feel kind of like a duck out of water And so, you know, giving people those those checklists and those questions and things to be able to really stand up for yourself or your child.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
So and I guess one of the reasons that I really felt pushed to do this also is that, we are a house full of neurodiversity, all a little different. But, I know you and I are gonna kinda talk about specifically, you know, when you're just looking for something. Mhmm. And with me, we don't have a lot of diagnosing in our house because, you know, my husband just wasn't really comfortable with it. And so I had to learn how to get creative and get the help that my kids needed without that extra step.

Anouk:
Mhmm. And I think that's big because a lot of parents that are listening probably have kids that are struggling, but they don't know why yet. Some might, but a lot of a lot of the time, it can take time like you were saying. It can take a lot of time before you get the diagnosis and, the right diagnosis. And based on where you are, and I think it's a bit better for that in the US than it is here, in Quebec. But, like, for ADHD, for example, here, you basically get nothing. You get probably, like, a little bit more time for exams, but that's about it. Like, it's starting to change very slowly.

Anouk:
But it's like, ADG, you take meds, and it disappears. Like, that's the thinking. So you don't get any accommodation at all. And, yeah, it there's in some places, they are starting to, like, have balls in the classroom to have the kids move during the and or allowing them to get out of the the classroom a little bit more. So it's it's starting, but it's very slow. And so sometimes you have the diagnosis, but it's not really helping the child anyway because what's the common accommodation doesn't fit your child needs.

Sarah Young:
Right.

Anouk:
So I think that's very important that that aspect of being able to get the accommodation even when you don't have the label. And even when you have the label, like and we've got one, and we were told that if you get that label for your child, you'll get services. And then once we did, they didn't give us much services that they did.

Sarah Young:
They're not magical words like some people think.

Anouk:
You know? They told us it was, but it was not true. So I think that's very important. And I'm one of those people who I had to fight myself to fight for my kids because it was not natural for me to, like, fight people in authority, if you will. Like, I Yes. Didn't wanted to look like that mom, the annoying mom who was asking all the time things and more things. So I'm really glad that we're talking. And that's so let's just dive into that. Like, I would say, what's first, can you just explain a little bit of what advocacy means for those of the students that might not be very know like, don't really know that that word.

Sarah Young:
And it's it's just a fancy way of saying speaking up. And and, I mean, really, that's all it boils down to. Advocacy is nothing more than speaking up. And so in my case, what I work with a lot is learning how to speak up for yourself, whether it's a mom who, like me, has chronic illness or, you know, neurodiversity or something and and women, it is so hard to get that acknowledged, especially adult women. And whether it's, you know, helping them speak up for that or just in general, I think, you know, people hear advocacy sometimes and they think of, oh, well, I'm going to, you know, petition something or do a big demonstration. It's not. It's really just, hey. You need to be able to have that meeting with your child's school and stand your ground.

Sarah Young:
You you have to be polite. You have to work with these people, but you have to have a way to stand your ground and get what your kid needs.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And and so at the root of it, that's all it's saying is just a big fancy label that people put on being able to stand up for whatever it is that's important to you, whether it's your health, your kids' education, your kids' health, whatever it is.

Anouk:
Mhmm. And I I'm guessing also, that's the difference because you were saying, like, big demonstration or the difference between self advocacy and advocacy. Like, self advocacy is not going out and doing something in public. It's just speaking up for your own needs or your child's needs because they need you to do it for them

Sarah Young:
Right.

Anouk:
Or with them. But yeah. And how would you suggest, addressing a school or in general, that school, let's be honest. But sometimes it can be others others places, but it's most likely school. How would you go on and because you said you need we need to collaborate, but at the same time, we need to get what we need for their children. So how how do you get that balance? Because it's not that easy.

Sarah Young:
It's not. It's not. And it takes, I mean, even which my kids are homeschooled now, but even after years of this, I still had to have, like, get on the phone with somebody calling me going into a meeting and, like, do certain things going in going, alright. You need that fight or flight kicks in.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
And we have to find a way to kinda walk it back so we don't walk in already in fight or flight. Mhmm. And I think it it starts with simple things. Like, I knew with my oldest from the time he was going into preschool that he he handled things a little differently. And and some of them were simple things. Like, he was left handed, and a lot of people still have a whole thing Godbout, well, let me keep handing it to you in your right hand and just push you to do And my husband's left handed, but can do a lot with his right hand because he was forced to use it growing up because Yeah. We're in our forties. And so little things like that or I knew that if you gave him 3 step directions, you'd lost him by the second step.

Sarah Young:
Yeah.

Anouk:
And he

Sarah Young:
did was just not gonna happen. He had the best of intentions and the biggest heart, but he just couldn't do it. Mhmm. And so I started even when he was young with making it a point, you know, and I don't know how it is in Quebec, but I know, like, over here, you usually find out a few days ahead of time who your teacher is for the for the year. And I would always have something already prepared for that.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And and even now, something I've shared in my, in my mini membership is a little PDF file where you can put your kid's picture because it's a little editable PDF and you can put some of the things about them, their strengths and weaknesses and stuff. Because I think it's important to kind of start the conversation off from the very beginning. Like, you know, before he even set foot in your classroom, hey. Here are some of the things that he's not great with, but here are some of the things that he does really well with. And and, you know, putting that stuff out there and kind of making sure I made that connection because what I found with, not all, but a lot of teachers and and people in the classroom, when I connected in a positive way to start out with, it was a whole lot easier for them to come back to me and be like, hey. I noticed he's struggling with this. Do you have any suggestions? Or maybe I wanna work on this at home or something. So I think getting ahead of it is the first thing.

Sarah Young:
It's getting ahead of it and trying to go in from the beginning. And then the other thing is there are so many great resources out there, that when you start asking for it, I I really push keeping a written log of everything. Mhmm. I actually even have a resource coming out. I'm working on as a checklist for an IEP binder because that's what we deal with a lot here. Do y'all have IEPs in Canada?

Anouk:
It's different name, but, yeah, it's similar.

Sarah Young:
And so so with that, you know, just kind of making sure you do your research as far as they're supposed to give you, your rights, your special education rights before you even go into a meeting. And you're supposed to have access to that so that you I I never got that.

Anouk:
Yeah. I was about to act like, does that really happen? I'm sure it doesn't.

Sarah Young:
No. Actually, I was interviewing somebody on my podcast, and she was telling me about it. I said, you what? How would you afford to go? I never had I never even knew that thing existed. And she was like, yeah. You're supposed to have it ahead of time so that you know what you have to. Wow. And but it's little things like that that there are so many resources out there. And I know as moms, the last thing we have is time.

Sarah Young:
You know? But, finding somebody who's been there ahead of you to to ask them, hey. Where did you go to find your stuff? Because if you go in there, you keep a log of, hey. I emailed such and such on this date trying to get a meeting because my kid is struggling or I did I emailed, you know, or whatever. Keeping a log of it so that you can go back to I am communicating with y'all. You're not communicating back. And when you have facts to back it up Intense of just, I have been calling y'all for weeks, then everybody on the other side gets defensive with that.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
Yeah. So when you can go on there and go, well, I'm I'm emailing you, and that way I have a written log. Mhmm.

Anouk:
Yeah. And it's easy to prove. Right.

Sarah Young:
And and I'm like and I'm not getting communication back. That gets a lot different response, I found, and and having things written out ahead of time. Even I, after all these years, if I don't have something written out when I go to the doctor

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
I get flustered because they always feel like they're rushed. And I'm

Anouk:
like Yeah.

Sarah Young:
God. I forgot to ask. Yes. You know? So having the stuff written out ahead of time when you go in there and be like, hey. You know? I found that my kid does really well if you, you know, stand beside him when you're showing him this. You know, when when the teacher's coming around the room, if you will stand beside him and point to it so he can see it, then he'll make the connection more. Or, hey. I've noticed that my child does really well if they get to have something to fidget with in their hand.

Sarah Young:
Mhmm.

Anouk:
And I

Sarah Young:
understand it can't disrupt everybody else in the room. So do you have any suggestions or these are things he fidgets with at home? Would any of these not bother you? You know, Mhmm. Coming in with options, coming in with a written idea of things, and and making sure you keep that communication open. Like, okay. Another thing I didn't know when we were in school is that here, when we do our individualized education plan meetings or our IEP meetings, that even though the meetings are set, like, once a year, I did not realize it's an ongoing thing. I was kind of told, so to speak, that, okay. Well, we put this in place, then we check back in next year. And, apparently, it's a living thing.

Sarah Young:
So, like, if we realize 30 days in, hey. The teacher is just not able to pull off what we've decided or it's really not helping him

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
Then I have the ability to reach back out to them and, again

Anouk:
Modify it.

Sarah Young:
And and say, hey. We need to redo this. We need another meeting. We need to redo this. And it can be, like, much less formal.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
But and even when my son changed school systems, then in private school, he didn't have an individualized education plan. And so when we changed to public school, then he didn't have one going in. I said, look. He has accommodations because of the evaluations we've done, and they were like, well, we need to give him 6 weeks to see how he does. And I was like, I don't think that's a good idea. Well, the second time I said, I don't think that's a good idea, then we I was like, fine. I'm gonna let you have your way, and I'm gonna see how it goes. And I said, but if he starts to fall behind, we're gonna revisit this because I know his confidence is a huge thing for him.

Sarah Young:
Mhmm.

Anouk:
And

Sarah Young:
I have fought tooth and nail to build that back up. I'm not losing it. And she was like, oh, it'll be fine. We always do it this way. And I was like, well and so sure enough, two and a half weeks into school, I emailed twice and then I I I picked them up and dropped them off. And so when I I went Intense afternoon to pick them up, I just propped myself onto the principal's office, and I was like, we need to have that next week. I'm not waiting to No. He is not learning anything.

Sarah Young:
He is not getting any work done. He has no idea what's going on. Mhmm. And I'm not doing this. There's no way. And so because I went in in person, then she went in and and set the meeting up. And, again, I mean, I still didn't get everything because, like, things like not knowing that I need to get the rights ahead of time and stuff. But, you know? So

Anouk:
Yeah. But I like the fact that you were in person, and I sure that can be a new choice sometimes. Like, when you're trying it and you don't get any answers back, you kinda need to push a little bit more. And I think that's that's the right way. And it's not always easy because they're sometimes very hard to reach. But yeah. And I that thinks I think that's very helpful. And I would say here, like you said, like, knowing the teacher a few days before.

Anouk:
Often we don't even know the day of. And and sometimes it can take a week before we know. Even when the school has started because we're so missing so many teachers that some classes don't even have a teacher by this start of the school year. They just have someone in the class. So, yeah, sometimes it's very complicated at the beginning, and it's very hard with ex especially for children that are already struggling. Like, they might have 3 different adults in their class for the first week, which is really the worst for lots of kids. But yeah. And I I really love how you you said, like, it's it's narrowing down to what the kids needs no matter the diagnosis because that you have one or not.

Anouk:
The diagnosis is not And then, like, NL, BL is not an answer or a solution. It's just part of an answer. It's just clues to who our children are. And so even if 2 kids have the same diagnosis, they don't necessarily need the same recommendation.

Sarah Young:
Right. And and I think another thing is, you know, we think of, okay. Well, my kid going into school when they're young. You know, they they have certain struggles or whatever, whether you have a diagnosis or not. Well, then another thing that I think you don't realize until you get an older kid is that some kids, especially if their struggles are more like a learning challenge

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
Then they're fine through lower in elementary school.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
And then all of a sudden, they get into, like, middle and high school level, and they're really struggling. Yep. Because it's not something that a diagnosis would necessarily even have been relevant. It's like, oh, well, the the way they process certain things or different things like that, or maybe they just weren't taught certain skills with a lot of people needing that skill building.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And and I think, especially if you have a neurodiverse person Yeah. Where we don't really have the scaffolding, It's more like it it all comes in in a different way. Mhmm. And so maybe I didn't get the skills to learn how to do this when I was younger. And so when they have that thing, well, you have a lot less connection in anywhere when your kid is older in school. It's more like, oh, when they're in high school, you drop them off, wave, and then sometimes you don't even pull up on the block. You know? You're like, from

Anouk:
being home. My son was going to school. He was biking to school when he got into high school. So I was not even close to the school.

Sarah Young:
And and for kids that age, they don't want their mom showing up and going, hey, to the teacher. So, again, you kinda have to get a little more creative when they're older with, you know, reaching out. And and I think even if you have to wait a week or 2 in the school year, reaching out and saying or reaching out to the office and saying, hey. I know we're, you know, going through some transitions in this class right now, but when we figure it out, I would love to have even if it's a phone call meeting with whoever's going to be working with my child just so we can get on the same page. And like I said, if you started out on that positive note

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
Then it you know, you kind of I think a lot of times, the school systems are just so overloaded, and they're so overworked.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
And when a parent comes at a teacher, immediately, a lot of teachers, no matter how well intentioned they are, like, you know, because, like, one more thing. And so when you kinda come at it from, hey. I know you've got a lot on your plate, but, you know, if there's anything I can do to help you, these are the things that help him. Is there anything I can do to help you make that easier? Mhmm. I mean, even down to when my kids were in preschool and it stunk at the time, but I would go in and buy, like, 8 pair of left handed scissors because they were only my kid was the only left handed kid in there, but inevitably somebody else is gonna grab scissors. Somebody else is you know? Yeah. And so I was like, I wanted to be certain he always had them. So I would buy enough so that and that's not always a possibility for everybody, but it's it's just some little things like that to think Godbout.

Sarah Young:
What can I do to make it easier in the classroom? You know?

Anouk:
Mhmm. And I think that going there with that opening of I'm not just going there to make things easier for my children, but making things easier for my children might definitely make things easier for the teacher. Because if my kids are struggling and if my kids get disruptive, for example, then it's a problem for a teacher. And if we go there with that in mind, things are gonna be easier. I would say it's harder when you have kids that adjust, like, really enter Intense and doesn't, like, show anything and keeps calm and then doesn't disturb the classroom, then nothing will be easier for the teacher. But when you have a child, it can be disruptive or, it it it can make the the teacher's life easier to do, things like that for sure. And yeah. And I I I would say I I love that that frame of mind of getting in to help the teacher also.

Sarah Young:
Well and, like and it wasn't my kid, but I remember when my kids were younger, I worked in the school a lot with them. Like, I substituted in the office and just different things and stuff, so I was around in the environment more. And so I remember there was another child, and it was a really new environment to him. He was young, and I remember his mom coming in and going, look. I know this doesn't make any sense, but he has these alphabet blocks. There's little wooden alphabet blocks, and she's like, he carries one with him every day. And if he gets upset, then you let him kind of hold it. It calms him down.

Sarah Young:
I never, in a 1000000 years, would have thought when he was upset to go, well, let me go check your book bag for a block. It never would have crossed my mind.

Anouk:
Of course.

Sarah Young:
But that one little conversation of her saying then whenever he would start to get upset before we hit full on meltdown

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
Then you go, hey. Do do we wanna get your block so you can hold that for a minute while you calm down? He was having he was young. He's having a lot of separation anxiety and stuff.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And and something as simple as that, you know, we could start to deescalate it. So sharing those little Yeah. Our kids all have those little quirks. And just sharing those little quirks so that it makes it easier.

Anouk:
Mhmm. Mhmm. And I think that what you you said also about the fact that some kids, the reality gets, like, more and more as the difficulty of school increases and the social difficult difficulty and the social like, when kids are young, they're just playing. There's no not lots of social pressure. But when they got into what the US's middle school or here out of, like, elementary school and then high school, social thing gets much more difficult. And so some kids might struggle more. And I I we had that experience here. Like, my kids were okay.

Anouk:
Most of their elementary, but once they reach, like, 5th, 6th grade, things started to be much more complicated. And we we add like, looking back, we add those little moments when we add, like, red flags, but it was so far and few bidd between that we didn't really Right. Like, now I'm looking back, and I'm like, yeah. This, this, this, this, this. But this is because now I know.

Sarah Young:
Right.

Anouk:
But it's hard. And then you get in high school, and then you have no control and no contact, and it's much, much harder. So I would uncringe people to not fear asking for those accommodation when it's little things and not wait for it to get big things. And because it's also easier to start to ask teachers for little things than it is to ask for that big thing or a thousand things.

Sarah Young:
And and, you know, like, when when my son was young, then it was simple things like, hey. You know, if you really want him to do this, classroom is a hard place to focus anyway. And so at the time, you know, I didn't even I I was aware of his neurodiversity, but I had no idea about the ADHD. Looking back, I can see a lot of things. I'm like, oh, yeah. Okay. But at the time, I had no idea, and and he what happened to evaluate it for anything, no medication or anything. So it was little things that I had learned, like, telling them, hey.

Sarah Young:
You know, if you really won't if you're getting ready to give him, like, instructions for something specifically, if you lightly touch his shoulders, arm, or something to get that attention

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
He's gonna hear you better. Mhmm.

Anouk:
If

Sarah Young:
you're standing across the room talking with your back to him and there's 3 kids next to him playing with something, that's gonna be what he sees.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
Not you.

Anouk:
He's never gonna I am that's true for a lot of kids anyway.

Sarah Young:
Yeah. It is. And, I mean, it's it's little things, but it's little simple things that don't make your child stand out and but give them that little bit of an edge. And, you know, like, I had told you, I think here in the States, it is different, but we did not want, for a lot of reasons. I think there's a lot of fear behind a diagnosis, and then Mhmm. There's the whole, well, is a diagnosis really gonna be helpful or not?

Anouk:
And it

Sarah Young:
that's very much depends on the case in each time. Yeah. So with my husband not wanting 1 and me, I'll be honest. I really wasn't sure if I did or not at that point. When he was adamantly against it, I was like, I don't really even have to decide if I want 1 or not. You Anouk? It'd be a true. It's like, okay. Because I kinda did, and I kinda didn't.

Sarah Young:
So I was like, well, I don't even have to stress it.

Anouk:
Yeah. Yeah. I I can let go of that decision. Right.

Sarah Young:
And but we have, what they call educational evaluations here. Mhmm. And it it was a little harder because I had to find somebody and insurance didn't cover as much of it as they would if it was a developmental evaluation or something. But, we have done 2 with my son because usually they do them every couple of years. But the second one we did was so so informative. And, you know, the doctor met with us originally, and she was like, okay. With his attention span and everything, at this point, he was even on medication for ADHD, but still don't have the best attention span. So she was like, you know, with everything, we're gonna break this up into 3 different sessions, and so we met with her 3 different times.

Sarah Young:
And it would be little things, like she would give him a problem to solve, or she would give him, you know, 5 words, and then they would do something. And then she would ask him the 5 words. And it was I didn't sit in for all of it because I didn't want to be super distracting to him. Mhmm. And so I would stay in in the beginning until he got comfortable and then leave the room. But just what I saw, like, he had no anxiety over it. He had a great time because they played with stuff and she was fun. And afterwards, I got this huge report.

Sarah Young:
I mean, it it was I wanna say, like, 17 to 27 pages and where she wrote out all these different things. And granted some of it is medical mumbo jumbo.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
But a lot of it that was backing up different things, but a lot of it was like, you know, he has he processes this way or, you know, he has great long term memorization, but his short term memory is is really struggling and and all these different little things. And so you could have told me he has ADHD or autism or any other thing, and it wouldn't have given me that information.

Anouk:
Yeah. Yeah. So I take that. Just a label is Right. Helpful to some extent because there's some general things that go on with people with ADHD, with people with, and that works for basically all diagnosis. But they are still individuals, so they still are different. So that is not a an a label. That is who your child is, and I think that's the the biggest thing is understanding your children.

Anouk:
Because like you were saying, we need to know what helps them to be able to advocate for them and what they need to be able to advocate. If we don't know, we cannot advocate for them. And so knowing that is priceless. Yeah. It's it's not priceless because it cost you a lot of money. But It did.

Sarah Young:
But it was so so helpful to be able to go back to the schools at that point and be able to say even then, like, he was in a private school, but I have to be like, hey. Look. I've got this. And we had a meeting, and I, you know, gave them a copy, said a chance, looked over it ahead of time. We had a meeting, and they were like, alright. Well, I really can't do anything about this, but what about this? Mhmm. And little things like, for him, one of the things because of the way he I've been telling them and telling them and telling them, but it's mom's word. And so with this, then one of the things we were able to do is, like, as far as spelling test, he struggled immensely with writing it because there was a processing disconnect.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
But so what they started allowing him to do is every week from a spelling test, after the test, they pull them out and verbally give it to him. And he could spell. And he would go from getting 1 out of 10 to getting 8 out of 10 if he verbally did it. And that that evaluation kind of let me have that little bit of push Mhmm. To be able to go, see, this is he he's not being difficult. He really what's in his head, he has a hard time getting out. And and even without that being a part of his evaluation, even when we've done, like, homeschool co ops and stuff, just kind of explain to them, hey. Writing is not his strong suit.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
So when he's going to do an essay or a paper or anything, we've gotten things transcription things or voice to text on his computer or whatever, and then he just has to go through and edit it. Mhmm. And so that way, you know, it takes that pressure off. Or another one that you don't even necessarily have to have accommodations for most cases is if your kid is struggling with writing, maybe they're a slow writer, maybe they struggle with processing, anything to do with writing. What I found is that a lot of teachers are willing to, at the end of class, get a written copy of notes if you ask. Most of them won't offer. But when I'm like, look, he can't write it off the board as you're talking

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And actually hear you at the same time, and he can't write it all in the amount of time before you move on to something else. Yeah.

Anouk:
Which is too much.

Sarah Young:
Right. And so I'm like, you know, taking that little bit of pressure off was another huge, huge thing.

Anouk:
Mhmm. Yeah. And so and I I would say it's knowing what to ask for is often very hard, especially for of course, for someone who's a teacher, it's easier because you have an idea. But when you're not a teacher and you have no contract really with the school, it's very hard to

Sarah Young:
Yes.

Anouk:
Have an idea of what's possible because not everything we do at home, of course, is possible in school.

Sarah Young:
Well, and it's a different environment. So they're asking different things of them, and I think that was one of the hardest things in the beginning of going, alright. I don't know about yours, but even though my kid loves to talk, he wasn't gonna tell me about his day, really. And so, like, understanding, alright, what goes on throughout the day. Mhmm. And sometimes you gotta get a little creative on trying to piece that together and and figure out, like, what goes on throughout the day? What are the things, the challenges that come up throughout the day? And then maybe what are the things that I think might could help with that? Because and it's a process, and it's a fluid process because right now it may be yeah. Right now it might be this is the struggle. And then later on, you're like, oh, well, he's mastered that, but this is the struggle.

Sarah Young:
And sometimes being on a yoga ball was great. We had one class that had, I don't know. She prep I don't know what she called it, but she had, like they had a booth in part of the room. She had, like, all kinds of different seating. Sometimes the kids could lay on yoga mats in the floor when they were doing work, like, all kinds of different things like that to be able to get more tactile input maybe.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
So and that's not possible everywhere. But No.

Anouk:
No. That's like that that teacher is very aware of that Yes. Of things. I would say that is I don't know in the US, but I find here it really depends on the teacher. Like, I've seen in classes thing lots of things like that. I'm like, wow. And other the same school, another class, there's nothing. So it really depends on how aware of all those things the teachers are.

Anouk:
It yes and no. Because my kids' school, they have special they add specialty classes, so they did have some, like, sensory stuff that was available for everybody, but there was not enough. But it's also a matter of money because they don't the government doesn't give them any money for the that stuff. They need to find extra money elsewhere. So it was, like, fundraising and things like that so they could buy some of those accommodating stuff. You know?

Sarah Young:
Right. And and, I mean, not to sound stereotyping, but a lot of times, if you have somebody who is either a teacher who is either a, dealt with it in a personal level, whether it's their own kid, a niece and nephew, somebody personal to them who has struggled with different things, or a younger teacher, a lot of times those are the ones who are a lot more creative about

Anouk:
Mhmm. Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And and I don't say that to sound ugly, but at the in my opinion, in my experience, I should say, that a lot of times like, we have one teacher whose nephew struggle with a lot of the same struggles that my son did. And so she was fantastic giving me solutions like, oh, well, this is hard for him. Have you thought about this?

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And I was like, well, no. Like, no. No. I hadn't because I am not the school teacher, and I didn't think about him needing this and so yeah. Yeah. So, you know, and and sometimes it's just a matter of getting chummy with people and and just chatting and and seeing you know? Because a lot of times in just general conversation, you can get people to kinda Mhmm. Start to, oh, well, I hadn't thought about it that way, but what about? And and, you know, that's just kind of a huge thing right there.

Anouk:
Yeah. And when you get and I would say, I'm guilty of not doing that. I should have. When you get a teacher that it's working well with 1 teacher, talk with them. Like, we we we have a tendency to just talk to the teacher where it's not going as well. Right. But when it is going well, talk with them and figure out what's what they're doing. Why it's going well with them? What are the things that they're doing that's work? And so that you might be able to bring some of that stuff next year because often Right.

Anouk:
Don't know for you, but here, teacher don't necessarily talk to each other and information doesn't transfer from right one class. And I always tell parents, like, each start of the new year, you need to to start and explain because there's lots of chances that the new teacher has no clue what your job needs are.

Sarah Young:
Correct. And and I know that in 1 year, I actually had a teacher go above and beyond. I asked within the year. I was like, look. Your year has been this has been the best school year we've ever had. I've seen the most growth out of them, the most confidence. And I was like, so I just wanna harness that. Well, she was just a fantastic teacher, so she went ahead and gave me some written tips and actually even reached out to the next grade level teacher and gave her some kind kind of she didn't necessarily take all the suggestions, but gave her, you know, hey.

Sarah Young:
These are some of the things that worked really well for him in our class. And so, you know, like I said, make sure you're checking Intense when it's not just a complaint because nobody wants to hear that. Yeah. And well, and even down to, you know, I I think another one that especially if you don't have a lot of a lot of paperwork to back up, you know, what they're supposed to be doing Mhmm. Then it is also something you have to kinda stay aware of. Are they actually holding your child accountable? Because we did have one time where the teacher was like, oh, well, if he can't do it, we're just gonna go and buy it. And I'm like, you can't just skip things that are too hard for him. Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
I mean, how do you expect him to learn the next thing if he hasn't learned this?

Anouk:
It's not gonna work.

Sarah Young:
Right. And so, you know, that is kind of a cautionary tale. Sometimes you also have to be aware of making sure, hey. He was really struggling on this the other day, and now I'm seeing that we're not getting anything on it. Let me check-in and see that he actually mastered they just kinda push that onto the side.

Anouk:
Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. That's a I think it's an important, yeah, very important reminder. I've never seen that, but I'm guessing I might have missed some of that for sure. Yeah.

Sarah Young:
I can tell happened.

Anouk:
Yeah. And I can tell that my kids are missing some stuff. So, yeah, I I think it's it it might have happened, and I didn't saw it. So, yeah. So is there, anything else you would have to would like to add before we finish?

Sarah Young:
I think we've talked a lot about school, but I think even in a doctor's if I don't have a diagnosis or anything, a lot of people don't want to hear you and you're like, oh, my kid needs speech or occupational therapy or whatever.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
But what I found is with almost all insurances that I've ever dealt with, then while I'm not gonna get as much services, I don't have to have a diagnosis to be able to go in there and say, hey. My kid's really struggling with, say, holding a pencil properly or something. Mhmm. And they won't give you as much, but you can usually get at least several sessions

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
Without having a diagnosis of any core or without trying to get a diagnosis. So even if it is something as simple as, hey, you know, my kid's really struggling with this and I don't want a diagnosis. I don't think we need that, but he needs help.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
Okay. Then you still have the same things that we talked about kind of apply. You still can have things in writing even if I know in one case, I had the teacher write a note to back me up about some particular skill he was struggling with, and so I was like, went to the pediatrician. I was like, you need to send us to OT.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
And he was like, well and I'm like, nope. See, it's not just me. The teacher even wrote, he's really struggling with a skill. We've been working on it. Mhmm. He's having a hard time with it. You know? And and like I said, without getting anything, I couldn't go for a year for it.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
But I think we got, like, 5 to 10 therapy sessions. And then the next time a specific problem popped up and that's something I don't think a lot of people realize is that, like I said, I know y'all system is different, but here in the states, you can get treatment, short amounts of treatment for multiple things, and it's usually covered under insurance as long as it's like I'm treating this specific thing, treating that specific thing. And so that's kind of I

Anouk:
would say and I don't know, like, the Canada in general is different. Like, each province is different. But here, you will get covered by private insurance for, like, OT or language you don't need the diagnosis for that. You can just go. We don't even need a reference from a doctor. You can just go with it won't make any difference on the insurance in general. So, like, it that that's not it doesn't have an impact.

Sarah Young:
And but That's awesome.

Anouk:
It doesn't cover entirely. It covers, like, a percentage of the amount you pay. So it's not accessible for everyone. But if you want, like, it there's that's in the private sector, but you can get those services in the public sector, and then you need a reference to get them. You don't necessarily need the diagnosis, but you do need the doctor to reference. And and there's a long waiting list. So it's yeah. And it's generally more for for kids that are struggling more.

Anouk:
Like, I I I try because I know my daughter will need to be evaluated eventually. And in the private, I need to pay $2,500 for an evaluation. So I was like, could we put her on the list? And then in 5 years, she's gonna get evaluated in the public system because I know it's gonna take 5 years. And her doc her doctor was like, no. I cannot. She doesn't struggle yet. I was like, yeah. So we're waiting for the kids to struggle, and then we're referencing unless that takes 5 years.

Anouk:
That makes sense.

Sarah Young:
Yeah. And and I think that's the thing. It's just it's such a broken system all the way around.

Anouk:
No. They're wearing a

Sarah Young:
mask. Yeah. I mean, it doesn't matter where you are. I think it's just you know? And I think you and I talked about it in the past about how if your kid like, one of my kids struggled immensely in school, but the teachers and the people in school never knew it. Yeah. Because he would hold it in till he got home, and then there were those tears and explosion and all that because it was just getting harder and harder.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
But because nobody else would see it, then it is so hard to get anyone to hear you.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Sarah Young:
And I think that's that's the number one thing in advocacy is just knowing it's exhausting. Yeah. Acknowledging it, just putting it out there. It is exhausting.

Anouk:
That's true.

Sarah Young:
Just keep going because in the long run, it is so worth it

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Sarah Young:
To have gotten your kid the skills they need or the treatment they need or or yourself. I mean Mhmm. I've been dealing with my own medical issues and I've had to go to the level of nuclear a few times, but, you know, that's what I had to do. And I'm like, it's important sometimes to be able to go there.

Anouk:
Yeah. And I was I I've just say, I've worked in a public system, and I can tell that when parents push, they get what they want at some point. It can take time, and they can, yes, be like people are talking about them negatively back behind closed doors, but they get what they need for their children. So at the end of the day, that's the most important. And even if it feels uncomfortable, that's what we're in for. It's to get our children what they need. And so yeah. And and, yeah.

Anouk:
I I I'm not gonna go there because Yes. That's a

Sarah Young:
whole another conversation. Yeah.

Anouk:
It's a slippery slope. But, yeah, it's definitely that. And I I love that you acknowledge that it's it's really, really exhausting, and it's hard, and it's uncomfortable, but it's needed for children. So I love that it's possible to get support. Yes. And so is there any resource that you loved as a parent or still love that you would like to share with the community?

Sarah Young:
So and I can send you the website, but it's a heart for all students dot com. Lindsay is amazing. I connected with her. I connected with her because I saw a bunch of her stuff on social, and I was trying to kind of understand more about my son as he gets older. And then when I found out that I was autistic, then that was she was the first person to be there to go. I mean, her website, she has book list, and they're divided into different categories. I mean, she is just fantastic. She works specifically with, with parents with kids who struggle.

Sarah Young:
Mhmm. But at the same time, she like I said, she was a fantastic resource. I mean, we went we spent hours and hours in Messenger when I was going through everything trying to figure out, well, where do I find where can I find information on this? Where can I find information on that? Because I was trying to understand myself more and and kind of figure out what would be best for me. And so even whether it's as a parent or a child, she's just fantastic. Won't try to butcher her last name. It's like Laviska, but I can't say it really well. So but Lindsay

Anouk:
We'll put the link in the show notes so that people can find her, New Zealand.

Sarah Young:
Yeah. But, yeah, heart for all students. She's fantastic.

Anouk:
Great. And if parents want support and help with their advocacy, how can they find you, work with you?

Sarah Young:
You can an easy way to do it is to go to my website, and you can even go to my website, sarahyoungllc.com backslash parent advocacy toolkit, and, you can just put your information in there. It gets you on my email list where I share resources, and it also gets you a free, PDF sent to your sent to your inbox. Mhmm. And on there, I've got, you know, usually a page of whatever is going on as well as, you know, all kinds of resources. I know here in I haven't added Canada to it yet, but here in the states, there's so many different special education sites that I found other people who have kind of linked out the great things. And so it's a place where you can go and get a lot of links for a lot of information. And and I try to update it at least once a month with new things. Maybe you're struggling with a picky eater.

Sarah Young:
Well, there's my favorite person for that on there. So there's a lot of links and information and some checklist and some information and stuff like that. So that's that's a free rep, free that's a free resource on my website. Great. And then or just checking out my website in general or my podcast.

Anouk:
And you have a a membership too?

Sarah Young:
Yes. And I have a a mini I have a membership, but the mini membership is, is really the the thing that we're working on a whole lot right now and putting a lot of stuff in. And it's only $7 a month, and it is a little mini membership on Facebook. I pop in there with tips. As a matter of fact, this afternoon, I have to go put a Halloween training I recorded in there because Halloween's one of those things that a lot of kids struggle with that we don't you know, we're like, oh my gosh. I want to enjoy the holiday, but how do I help my kid do that when

Anouk:
That's true. That shouldn't be the situation. Issues or whatever. We should do an entire episode on holidays end.

Sarah Young:
Yes. And Anouk then and then the membership, I drop a training every month. I've got group experts that come in every month. So it it's a lot of fun. And then, also, also, you have the support of other moms that get it, and it's a month to month membership. Maybe you're going through a tough time right now, and you want to jump in for a few months and just get a little bit of support and resources, and then Mhmm. We hope you stay. But there's no commitment.

Anouk:
Great. Excellent. So we'll put the link in the show notes so people can find you easily. So thank you so much for being here, Sarah Briere, Sarah, today. Was very nice to chat with you again.

Sarah Young:
Alright. Thanks for having me, Anouk. I appreciate it.

Anouk:
I'm so glad you joined me today and took that time out of your intense life to focus on finding a new way to parent that works for you and your kids. To get the episodes at So That Day Drop, make sure to subscribe to the podcast, and please leave everything in review so other parents can find it too. Also, check out all the free resources on my website at familymomentsdot ca so you can take action on what's the most important for you right now. And take a deep Briere. Keep going. We're all in this together.