49 – Navigating Big Emotions – With Lacie Newton

Anouk:
Welcome to the podcast. Today, we will be talking about a very great and simple way to talk and work on emotional regulation with our kids. And to do that, we are welcoming Lacey over on the podcast. Let's do it. Welcome to Parenting the Intense. Where we'll talk all about how we can drop the general parenting advice that doesn't work with our emotionally intense kids anyway and let go of the unrealistic expectations society puts on us as parents. Together we'll find solutions and ideas that work for you and your kids. Chances are deep down you know what they need.

Anouk:
But you need a little encouragement to keep going on other days and permission to do things differently and help you fully trust that you already are a wonderful parent to your exceptional but challenging kids. Are you tired of feeling overwhelmed and uncertain when it comes to parenting your emotionally intense child? Do you often find yourself playing with guilt, fearing that you're not doing enough to help them navigate their intense emotion? You are not alone. Many parents face these challenges and struggle to find the right path forward. But take a deep Briere, there's hope. That's why I created the Parenting the Intensity community. Imagine having a clear roadmap tailored specifically to your child's unique needs and your family's reality. Picture feeling empowered and confident in your parenting, knowing that you are providing the support and understanding your child needs. It may seem like an untenable dream right now, but I'm here to tell you that it is within reach.

Anouk:
Come and join us for our monthly group support to connect with other parents and get supported with your challenge right now. You also get 1 on one chat and audio office hours for the things that you're really not ready to share in the group, workshop, tools, courses to help you in the process of finding that balance of parenting in a way that works for you, your child, and your family. Hi, Lizzie. Welcome to the podcast. I'm glad to have you here.

Lacie:
Hi. I am so glad to be here. Yeah. It's been a pleasure.

Anouk:
Yeah. So can we can you introduce yourself and let us know why you do what you do?

Lacie:
Sure. I'm Lacey Newton, and I have, my my business is called Mama Simpatico, and I am here to help and support moms who might be wondering why mom life is a little bit harder than they thought it would be and it's really a passion for me because this this is my story. I I was an older mom. I chose to be a mom. Excuse me. I I thought I was ready. You know, my my husband and I both worked. We had a home and then mom life was hard and it was very confusing for me.

Lacie:
So it took a lot of soul searching and deep dive you know into what the heck is going on for me to understand what was happening and to develop my toolbox even further to grow into motherhood and accept you know what was happening and to change my relationship with it. And I really learned, you know, what was happening in my own mind that was getting in my way and was able to develop a new relation to develop a new relationship with it. And, I became a certified mindfulness teacher because mindfulness was actually my solution because I you know, at the crux of it all, I was in experiencing postpartum depression and anxiety, and I was nursing and I didn't want medication. I know that there are medications that are fine. Mhmm. But that was a choice that I was too anxious to make. Mhmm. And so therapy appointments were, like, you know, 2 weeks apart, and I'm like, I need something now.

Anouk:
Yeah. In between.

Lacie:
So in between. And I was like, what do I do with this situation here right now?

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Lacie:
And so I I had to learn, and I did. And the more I started to talk about my story, the more I heard that it was very common.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Lacie:
You know? Yeah. We have all these. We get this idea of becoming a mother, and we have these visions fill our heads of what it might be like. And then, you know, reality comes, and it often isn't exactly that. I mean

Anouk:
Yeah.

Lacie:
Anything we plan for, you know, in life Is

Anouk:
it is it sometimes that? I I'm guessing it's really rarely what we were expecting.

Lacie:
Yeah. You know? And then so how do we settle with that and how do we depersonalize that? Because it felt so personal. I was really questioning, you know, like I just I was so low I wondered if I was the right person for my children. You know, I really doubted it, and it was a scary place to be. And I know I'm not alone. And so my my goal with mama simpatico is to support moms and, really help spread the message that there's nothing wrong with you. There's nothing wrong with your child. You are the right mom for your child.

Lacie:
Mhmm. And regardless of what the messages you are getting from your culture, from your family, from the media, from Instagram, you know, there is this path that's also available where things do feel like you are the right person for this child. This child is the right one for you, and everything is okay the way it is and we just need to work with that. Mhmm. It's you know we get these messages you know in the you know on social media from everybody that you know you're supposed to be a certain way as a mom your parents were a certain way you know, your sister-in-law is doing things a certain way, all the kids you know all the parents at school are doing things a certain way, we get all these perfectly curated images of motherhood on our Instagram feeds, and we get these judgments of moms who are doing things differently. Moms, you know, get judged when their kids have behaviors, moms get judged when their house is messy, moms get judged when their clothes are messy, you know, and it's just it's incredibly, like I don't know. It's like a can't win situation.

Anouk:
Yes.

Lacie:
You're expected to do everything. You're expected to do it all, but not have a not struggle while you're doing it all.

Anouk:
No. Of course. No. You should you should rise above everything, and you should have it all together. And this is and I I think, like, when we have emotionally intense kids, it's especially hard because all of those expectation just don't fit the reality that we're in also. Like, it doesn't fit most people reality, let's be honest. But when things are different in our life, it's even more different than the the the expectation. So I I love that, what you wanted to share with us.

Anouk:
It's kind of a road map in some way. I don't know if you see it that way, but, the comfort plan, which is to help navigate big emotions. And I think that's one of the probably the most requested topics. So I love to have many episodes on that because things can resonate with people differently. So, can you dive into that and let us know what what the comfort plan is? How it's

Lacie:
Sure. And I'll I'll give a little bit more backstory to how it's evolved for me too because I'm a special education teacher by day and, I I taught special ed for years years in what was called the therapeutic learning classroom and for it was emotionally Intense it was for emotionally and behaviorally intense school in our or I'm sorry it was for emotionally and behaviorally intense kids in the public school and I taught at the middle school level and this was a classroom with with large children that, you know, have strong children. Mhmm. And we had big behaviors. And, I had experience in applied behavior analysis and a lot of training in that and and so I would use that in that classroom, supporting the kids. We had therapists in there, but I had a confidence with supporting kids with big emotions and big behaviors. And then I became a mom and I had a 3 year old

Anouk:
with

Lacie:
big emotions and big behaviors and my confidence was shot. I was like, I don't know what to do because I realized that with what I had been trained in with applied behavior analysis and I don't care to get into a huge discussion on it because I think it can be done differently in all kinds of places. But what I had learned didn't wasn't what I wanted to do in my home. Mhmm. Because I didn't feel connected to my daughter Mhmm. During that. It felt like I was addressing the behavior, but not the person. Yeah.

Lacie:
And, it it took me a long time to figure out that that's why I felt completely underequipped.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Lacie:
And so the evolution of the comfort plan came from my experience with deep diving into what's happening and relearning, like, how I want to address big behaviors, on a deep emotional level. Mhmm. Because I wanted to get through these big tantrums, and big experiences with connection and not feeling like a crappy mom and not feeling like there's something wrong with her. And so it was really challenging. But through through my evolution, through mindfulness, through her becoming more verbal and learning what was happening, the comfort plan emerged. And so what the comfort plan is it's like it's this go to it's like okay things are intense seek comfort and it's just that easy. And I've worked with moms who are like well I was afraid I was going to reinforce this big behavior I don't want it to be more but what I'm message I'm trying to share and is that when we are experiencing a huge emotion in our bodies and our kids are experiencing a huge emotion when they have big behaviors. So yeah it's just the tip of the iceberg but inside there's big emotion.

Lacie:
Our brains are literally shifting from working in our our prefrontal cortex when right behind our forehead where we're able to learn, able to communicate, we're able to problem solve. Our kids Briere are now in our our more primitive or Briere, our limbic system, and they are reacting through flight flight, you know, fawn and, freeze. So they are in their their stress response. There is no real learning there. There is survival. We're in survival mode. And so the only thing that can get that prefrontal cortex back online is to get out of the survival mode. And we we when we are feeling comfortable we our survival mode brain is turned off.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Lacie:
So they are mutually incompatible.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Lacie:
So when we approach our kids as they are this fear you know, they're they're in this intense fear and their their behaviors are to protect themselves, we can start to see that we just need to soothe them and tell their and send signals to their emotions and their body that they're safe and so and you know I don't want to send a message that any parent is like triggering major safety concerns like you're you're doing okay you know it's not that don't take it personally it's just how their brains and bodies are working. And so when we say, you know, in my mind, I I'm now, okay, what can I do to help my child feel more comfortable? Because we can do the learning later. We we can reflect later when her brain is on. We can do the problem solving. Like, well, what if we do this differently? We do that later. So we can do that through you know physical touch, we can do that through comforting words, we can do that through our environment shifting in our environment because sometimes the environment is just retriggering Mhmm. That stress. So the comfort plan is really just making up making some like brainstorms before the big event you know what would bring comfort to this situation And just having that be the default like letting the rest go.

Lacie:
Safety of course but then comfort. Mhmm. And then you can always come back later. I you know, kids do not want to have these big aggressive or big emotionally like you know expressive situations. They don't want that. We're not going to be reinforcing that. And you know when I do work with parents I do talk about yes there's times where our kids have some learned behaviors that we're like, hey. You're learning to put on this, you know, little things.

Lacie:
You've you know, it worked in the past, but it's not the big, big stuff. It's just

Anouk:
not No. And and I think at some point, you kinda you kinda see the difference. Like, you see when it's just like, they can very easily snap out of those learned behavior and learned reaction that are used for whatever purposes, but it's it's really different. When they have those bigger emotion, you're not gonna, like, make a joke and they're gonna stop. It it's not that easy. It's Right. They're way deeper than that. When it's, like, more surface level, you you know, like, you're as a parent, you know, you can see it, and it's like different quality.

Anouk:
Yeah. There's a different depth and that the emotion in it's like sometimes just like, I would say just naming it. Like, you're you're you're you're exaggerating a little bit right now. And if the child is like, yeah. They are. If they're really reacting even more, you've got it wrong. That was not exaggeration. But, like, when you just, like, make fun over in general, when they don't have really big emotion, they will snap out of it.

Anouk:
And just it was just trying to get something or losing it. But when it's really big, it's it's not the same. Like, you cannot get them out of them well, out out of there just easily or Right. It's it's way different.

Lacie:
Yes. And, I I work with my families in teaching them this 1 to 5 scale because it's a very easy way to communicate that and what you're describing is number 3 on this scale. So, you know, what we are talking about with that lower level, so level 1 is just completely you know, calm and and not not feeling a big intense Emotionally. And the the the 5 is the biggest emotion we're experiencing. So, you know 1 and 2 we vacillate between 12 all day long. It's normal. We're not expecting anybody to be a 1. We even go to 3 most days most of us but 3 is the tipping point.

Lacie:
Once we're at 3 if we're not employing some kind of, you know, tool Mhmm. To self regulate, we're gonna go back we're gonna go up to 45.

Anouk:
Yeah. Yeah.

Lacie:
So 3 is where we wanna learn where our kids are showing a 3 on the outside because they're more likely to be a 3 on the inside. And it's really, critical to to for me to to look at it as the outsider inside because all I know as a parent is the outside. Yeah. And I trust my my children and the student you know, the kids, my students, because I'm a teacher, I say that, but also my family's kids. We give them ownership of labeling their inside.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Lacie:
We're not gonna tell them what what their experience is because it empowers them to share it with us. So all we can ever say is, well, it looks like this on the outside. Mhmm. And then, you know, so differentiating between the inside and the outside. The inside's the way it feels. The outside's the way it looks. And it helps give language to our kids. Well, you know, you're a level 4 and I so a 3 is, like, usually whining, crying, pouting, maybe using some old tricks that you don't want to use but, you know, just offering that replacement, you know, way of saying something it doesn't work pouting, stomping that kind of thing.

Lacie:
Level 4 is usually, like, really crying loud maybe yelling maybe maybe kinda throwing things a little bit, but I save level 5 for the things that could be injurious

Anouk:
to people.

Lacie:
Slamming doors, you know, throwing things at people, fighting, stuff like that. Mhmm. And so it gives a language to help the kids start to also realize what what they're doing because in the heat of the moment, when their limbic system is on and they're they're in their reptilian you know, they're they're in their like you know primitive Briere. They're not in control of their bodies and so when we go back and reflect that's when we can we can talk about you know what you did see as the parent. But all of this you know is really best done with a plan of kind of phased out plan. And I do wanna put out there first is that, actually, when I work with a parent, the first comfort plan plan is how can I bring my self comfort?

Anouk:
Yeah.

Lacie:
Is this how can what can you do when this emotionally charged situation starts bubbling up to ground yourself so that you can be the calmest person in the room? So that you can bring yourself comfort. So that you stay at a level 3 and you don't get higher than a 4 or 5. So that you feel good after the situation is over.

Anouk:
Yeah. Yeah. I think that's something that we, like, address all the time. It's the the parent. It start with us as a parent. And as much as we would like to fix kids, that's not how it works.

Lacie:
Right.

Anouk:
Right.

Lacie:
So yeah the comfort plan first step is really just like okay so okay so my my kids starting to get a little bit elevated this is the situation I know

Anouk:
how to

Lacie:
give myself comfort and often it's you know just reminding ourselves that either you know through words we can say something like well it's okay so it's in in parenting there are hard moments and this is one of them. Mhmm. You know sometimes just remembering that it's just not you it's just parenting. There are hard moments. Mhmm. Sometimes it's, you know, doing a a self compassion kind of thought. And I often teach, you know this is it's understandable that I feel frustrated you know fill in the blank because and just offering ourselves that understanding of our emotions brings a lot of regulation to our own internal system. Being understood in general will help regulate anybody's system.

Anouk:
Mhmm.

Lacie:
And so bringing understanding to ourselves in that moment in our own minds can help. Also, it could be just putting on, you know, more comfortable pants. You know like your kids a little high you know you can tell it could happen today. Get comfortable clothes on you know make sure you have water nearby things like that And so getting comfort for yourself and then number 2, getting comfort for your child And, you know, you can even parents can even develop a comfort plan with their child out of the moment.

Anouk:
Yeah. Of course.

Lacie:
You know? You know, and we use this in my house a lot. My daughter has a lot of sensory physical triggers, I guess, I could say with clothes and just some things, and she's labeled them the bugs. And, you know, that's her word. And so the bugs we we talk about the bugs. Like, it's just it's it's as normal as feeling happy in the house. Yeah. And I've asked her out of the heat of the moment what helps, and it's hugs. And then she gets the bugs and she's like, no.

Lacie:
Don't touch me. I'm like, just a reminder, you know, hugs help. And it took a while, but she would slowly open to her own suggestion. And now we have this this thing where she calls for me and I know she's laying on the floor and I go and I hug her for like 3 minutes And it just calms her body down. It's what works for her.

Anouk:
Yeah. And I that's interesting because what you said, like, you had identified that out of the moment and in the moment. And I and that and we can reflect on our own experience. We know what helps, but often when things are going bad, we are not able to go there. Like, I I I can tell you that when I go, I don't feel as good. I don't wanna do yoga as much as when I feel good, but it's when I don't feel good that I should do it more. So that's an important thing to like, she knows that's as helpful in her, but in the moment, she doesn't she won't be able to reach that necessarily, and she needs the help of the parent to be able to reach that without forcing, of course. But as you said, reminding her that that's helpful for you.

Anouk:
Can I argue? And now, like, it's helpful.

Lacie:
Yeah. Now she's able to see it at a lower level. You know, we we talk 1 to 5 all the time in our house. And another thing, you know, about 1 to 5 is it it's a way to communicate without words.

Anouk:
So Just the end.

Lacie:
Our house. We yeah. In our house. Even with her sibling too, should we have we know that if, you know, if we hold up the number 4, the number 5, anything, it means I don't really wanna talk right now, but it's not personal. It's not about you. Mhmm. I'm just I'm grumpy for whatever reason. Mhmm.

Lacie:
And so it really opens the door of communication and understanding.

Anouk:
Yeah. Love that. It's a great way also for siblings to clearly understand. And when kids cannot express, like, I'm feeling bad or I'm feeling this way, at least they can say, I'm feeling like a 4. Like, just don't bother me.

Lacie:
Yeah. Exactly.

Anouk:
It's a it's a great boundary.

Lacie:
Yes. Because our language is in the prefrontal cortex, You know?

Anouk:
So, you

Lacie:
know, it is a step towards communication, but it doesn't require words.

Anouk:
Mhmm. And, of

Lacie:
course, if we can get to the point where we can talk about it, we are getting more out of

Anouk:
Yeah. We're calmer.

Lacie:
Part. You know, there's this, you know, name it to tame it kind of idea in mindfulness where if you can name your emotion, you're starting to to work with it. But our kids are not always there. No. None of us adults aren't always there. So sometimes we just regulate ourselves even by saying, wow. This is a level 5. I don't know what it is.

Lacie:
I don't know what emotion it is, but it's a level 5 for me. Mhmm. And this also brings in, this idea it brings in more understanding for the whole family because it's so fluid, this 1 to 5 system in our house, and it has been with some of the the folks that I work with, but I can get to this point where I I know my own levels. If I'm a level 3, I cannot say yes to glitter for my kids. I cannot.

Anouk:
I totally get that.

Lacie:
If I come back if I give them the glitter, no matter how much they say they're gonna clean it up.

Anouk:
Yeah. If I give them There's gonna be some everywhere.

Lacie:
There's gonna be some everywhere, and that's gonna take me up. That's gonna take me, you know because I've because I'm I'm a we're adults like we have bills we have work we have rude people we have all this stuff in our own lives that triggers us You know? And that's what I love about the comfort plan and my when I teach navigating big emotions is really the overarching, program that I I teach with this, But it it teaches a communication that normalizes that us adults are having big emotions irregardless of what is happening with our kids. So then when the kids come in, it's it's another trigger, and that's okay. It's it's a human thing to be triggered by this. You know? Because like I said before we're getting all these messages of what it's supposed to be and you know so we start to question ourselves. But this how we start to work with it, how we start to normalize. Like, this is parenting. Mhmm.

Lacie:
This is parenting for me and my child and what I this is what I'm working with. So when my kids my, you know, it it also depersonalizes my tricky moments, you know, as as as adults. So when my kids are wanting to do something that I feel I already have this tension in my body. Like, I already I can feel it, you know, because I practice mindfulness and I'm pretty in tune. Not that I get it right all the time. I would like to caveat that. But once I realized that I am I am slightly, you know, kind of just on edge, I'm a level 3 myself, I can tell them, you know what? I would love to bring out the glitter, but we're gonna have to wait because I've got a few grown up things going on that I need to deal with or I I need to go take a rest. I'm a level 3 for some grown up reasons.

Lacie:
But when I'm feeling more like I can help with the glitter and the the you know, any messes that come, I know you're gonna clean it up most you know, yourself. I know you told me that, but I need to be a level 2 or 1. Mhmm. They they realize what's happening because we've talked about it so much. Yeah. And and the thing is they're not taking it personally. When I've come to them without doing that and I'm in a grumpy mood Mhmm. My kids think I'm mad at them.

Anouk:
Yeah. Yeah. And they so easily think that even if that's not the case and that's not why we're trying to convey, but just the fact that we we are not in the great mood, kids will really fast integrate that they did something wrong. So

Lacie:
They take it personally.

Anouk:
Yeah.

Lacie:
So this is the way to separate that. And it it breaks my heart the times that I wasn't able to, you know, and we're nobody's ever gonna get it right all the time, but, you know, it offers a conversation for repair too. You know? I am so sorry. I was a level 4. I should have done this differently, You know, in modeling, like, gosh. I should have told you I was a level 4 and I should have taken a break and then come back to you. You know? And it gives them some understanding so that we can we can keep that communication, attunement, and connection going through the rough patches.

Anouk:
Yeah. I really love that. That's that's a really I love that simp the simplicity of that way of talking about it. Like, it doesn't even require words. So that's great. Thank you very much for sharing that. I think it's a very great tool for parents to use and start using. And and I'm we'll we will have to, have you over again, to go deeper on on that.

Anouk:
And mindfulness, I think, also would be great. We we do we did have some episodes on that, but I would love to dive deeper on the link between the 2. So we'll have to have you over again. So thank you very much for being here. Is there any resource that you use or love that you would like to share with the listeners?

Lacie:
Yeah. You know, when I was, when I had those troubles as the as the mom of a, you know, 2 or 3 year old, I leaned on the Janet Lansbury podcast a lot and she was one of my what I call mama mentors, you know, we got to collect these mama mentors that will guide us to be the moms that we want to be and so for any listener who she Janet Leigh Anne's very really targets younger children under 5. So any listener with that age group, she offers a lot of tools to help with what she calls respectful parenting. And, it felt really good for me to learn from her when I was Great. When I was going through it.

Anouk:
Thank you. I haven't heard of her, so that's right. And, yeah, I I love always having new resources to share. So thank you. And if parents wanna know more and work with you, how can they find you?

Lacie:
Yes. You can find me at mamasympatico.com. I'm on Instagram at mamasympatico Anouk I love to connect and talk. I love talking this, you know talking about this. It's it's it's one of those things that it's like, wow. Kinda got through it and, really did some deep diving, so I have a lot of thoughts on it and I'd love to share.

Anouk:
Yeah. Thank you. That's great. So I'm gonna put all the link links in the show notes so that people can find you easily. So thank you for being here today.

Lacie:
So much, Anouk. Thank you.

Anouk:
I'm so glad you joined me today and took that time out of your intense life to to focus on finding a new way to parent that works for you and your kids. To get the episodes at soon as they drop, make sure to subscribe to the podcast. And please leave everything in review so other parents can find it too. Also, check out all the free resources on my website at familymoments. Ca so you can take action on what's the most important for you right now. And take a deep breath. Keep going. We're all in this together.